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Post by kevlar on Jan 15, 2021 9:02:21 GMT -6
No, I didn't get suckered again!!! lol Just came across a few things yesterday that reminded me of my fight with them, so thought I would see if they have improved any. No, they have not. I thought I should keep this in the spot light and hopefully save others the money and headaches I went through.
If anyone that sees this is thinking of buying something from them, do not, DO NOT give them one cent until you have the product in your possession. And for trucking companies and contractors, I would just avoid them all together. Do a lot of research into their history, you will find the true story behind them, don't be like me and look them up and see that they have been around for 35+ years and assume they must be decent people, they are not. If you have unfortunately been sucked in, feel free to PM me and I will offer my advice. The only good thing I got from dealing with them was I got to meet and talk to a few very nice people who helped me out as much as they could.
Here are a couple links, notice the recurring theme.
And for anyone looking for my story.
Me being the way I am, if someone ever screws me over, they have gained a "friend" for life, you are welcome Leon's for the free advertising.
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Post by kenmb on Jan 15, 2021 10:01:23 GMT -6
It's rather sad. Not just regarding Leon's. I am thinking about a situation where you pay up front. The entire reason for paying on delivery is to protect yourself from a shady business. Especially with something like production line doing multiple units. The manufacturer really has little risk if building a production unit and the buyer backs out at 11th hour. The manufacturer is expected to have another buyer sometime soon.
For a the few years I was managing our department at work where we were designing and building power centers specifically to a client's design requirements for potash mines underground (meaning the buyer was really the only customer) we still never used any kind of full payment up front system. At the most we did was interim billing. If you had four $250,000 units on the go and a six month time frame from the time you ordered material to shipment, a business doing $4M a year had a lot of capital tied up, and risk. So occasionally we would bill for something like transformers showing up in our shop. The customer was invoiced so they now owned them. If we went bankrupt then they had full claim.
But it was really about the customer understanding our needs for cash flow. The difference I am pointing out here is Leon's is not really sharing risk at all with the customer by asking for payment up front. And as it is playing out, I am seeing as scamming the customer. This is my take based on my experience working in similar circumstances as Leon's. And I have had the same run around trying to collect from a business like Leon's as seen in comments of the BBB link. We didn't get the invoice, resend it. No, need to send it to this other person. They aren't here now, send it to me, I will take care of it. Etc. I recognize a shady business when reading those comments because I have experience with it first hand.
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Post by shmiffy on Jan 15, 2021 12:38:55 GMT -6
I saw a Leon ad a couple days ago and Kelvar’s problems with them are the first thing that came to mind.
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Post by Oatking on Jan 15, 2021 21:20:49 GMT -6
The problem kev had might be here to stay with many companies producing products "just in time inventory" yeah the term .. Just in time, leaves alot to the imagination.
I still dont get why Leons could not buy back an implement from another dealer sitting on a dealer lot collecting dust. Seems like poor allocation of product. wonder how the other guys made out?
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Post by snapper22 on Jan 19, 2021 18:31:15 GMT -6
The problem kev had might be here to stay with many companies producing products "just in time inventory" yeah the term .. Just in time, leaves alot to the imagination. I still dont get why Leons could not buy back an implement from another dealer sitting on a dealer lot collecting dust. Seems like poor allocation of product. wonder how the other guys made out? This has been FNA business model since inception. Throw in a bogus grain terminal procurement and fertilizer plant build to hoodwink farmers to raise capitol. I was talking with someone who told me they just became a Leon dealer. I didn’t have the heart to tell him. I’m kinda regretting it now. |
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Post by cptusa on Oct 13, 2021 12:51:48 GMT -6
I wonder over to (f)agtalk once in awhile but don't have an account there or I'd link this thread. Some guy recently go screwed by Leon's.
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Post by jcalder on Oct 13, 2021 15:21:13 GMT -6
I saw a Leon ad a couple days ago and Kelvar’s problems with them are the first thing that came to mind. Ditto. Every time I see the word Leon I think of the crap he went through. |
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Post by kenmb on Oct 13, 2021 16:22:26 GMT -6
Saw a thread on Ag Talk also Captain, think it was yesterday. Really sad to hear the guys story. As much as I would like to defend Leon's and a Sask company, their actions really are running in the criminal sphere. Lots of good people not only getting screwed out of their money, but the endless stream of BS coming from Leon's is just insult to the financial injury.
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Post by kenmb on Oct 13, 2021 16:24:31 GMT -6
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Post by kevlar on Oct 14, 2021 22:20:15 GMT -6
Still blows my mind how this allowed to happen. Shows how our legal system works. Every once in awhile I will do a Google search on these guys just to see what they are up to, and no, they haven't changed one bit. I often consider putting new links on here of their recent reviews to keep this active and hopefully prevent someone from getting scammed, but not sure if it's doing any good. If I thought it would do any good to get some kind of lawsuit going to shut them down, I would do it, or help in any way I could, not for any monetary gain, but to drive them into the dirt where they belong. I don't think that would go very far after seeing how things worked with my ordeal.
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Post by Albertabuck on Oct 15, 2021 8:57:36 GMT -6
What I can't understand is why are people paying for items long before they are going to take delivery? I would never do that on something like that.
Maybe a deposit sure, but balance upon delivery.
But as mentioned, I can't believe they can keep going. Read somewhere there has been a name change, in the corporate world, thats usually an indicator and a method of escaping past debt
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Post by northernfarmer on Oct 15, 2021 13:19:16 GMT -6
Still blows my mind how this allowed to happen. Shows how our legal system works. Every once in awhile I will do a Google search on these guys just to see what they are up to, and no, they haven't changed one bit. I often consider putting new links on here of their recent reviews to keep this active and hopefully prevent someone from getting scammed, but not sure if it's doing any good. If I thought it would do any good to get some kind of lawsuit going to shut them down, I would do it, or help in any way I could, not for any monetary gain, but to drive them into the dirt where they belong. I don't think that would go very far after seeing how things worked with my ordeal. Kevlar, AB brought up a good question as per Leons requesting full payment even before the item is built, never mind delivered. So I was curious from your experience, how did they lay out the situation in that they somehow "deserved" full payment before they had lifted a finger as its not as if their builds would be one off specialty items but more so of mass produced pieces of equipment that if one customer backed out and didn't take, another would take it instead. Like AB pointed out, typically if anything is done in a money exchange its a small percentage to hold the product and in theory they could retain that if the customer backed out. Then when the equipment ordered was not only completed but delivered to its destination would a company then request and rightfully so, payment in full ( assuming it was the correct piece of equipment delivered as per the order ). |
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Post by kevlar on Oct 15, 2021 20:54:47 GMT -6
Still blows my mind how this allowed to happen. Shows how our legal system works. Every once in awhile I will do a Google search on these guys just to see what they are up to, and no, they haven't changed one bit. I often consider putting new links on here of their recent reviews to keep this active and hopefully prevent someone from getting scammed, but not sure if it's doing any good. If I thought it would do any good to get some kind of lawsuit going to shut them down, I would do it, or help in any way I could, not for any monetary gain, but to drive them into the dirt where they belong. I don't think that would go very far after seeing how things worked with my ordeal. Kevlar, AB brought up a good question as per Leons requesting full payment even before the item is built, never mind delivered. So I was curious from your experience, how did they lay out the situation in that they somehow "deserved" full payment before they had lifted a finger as its not as if their builds would be one off specialty items but more so of mass produced pieces of equipment that if one customer backed out and didn't take, another would take it instead. Like AB pointed out, typically if anything is done in a money exchange its a small percentage to hold the product and in theory they could retain that if the customer backed out. Then when the equipment ordered was not only completed but delivered to its destination would a company then request and rightfully so, payment in full ( assuming it was the correct piece of equipment delivered as per the order ). How the whole story began was we were looking for a scraper but couldn't find anything we wanted. Mostly for shits and giggles I gave them a call, mostly expecting to hear that they don't sell directly from the factory but would have to go to a dealer. This is how their story began. They just fortunately had one they could sell me, but it wasn't new, it was a demo but was used to take around to trade shows so not really used. It was currently at a trade show for the next week somewhere in the northern States I believe it was, he told me, and it would take a couple weeks to get it moved back, there might have been another show the next weekend possibly he claimed (long enough ago I can't remember every single detail) either way it would be delivered to my door in 2 weeks. He said he could knock off some of the price as it was a demo and give me whatever kind of promotion they had on for the current show they were at, pay for it and it's a done deal. Wired him the money, the bank had all the details and serial #'s. Now this was my fault, I know that, but like I had said before, a company that had been around that long must be reputable. Right?  There likely isn't a farm around in western Canada that doesn't have, or has had, a piece of Leon equipment, that must say something? Wrong! Most people here wouldn't have any issue paying for something from RME or Mazer's and have it delivered at a later date, and this wasn't a huge sum of money so didn't give it too much worry. So it was supposedly already built, just needed to deliver. Only thing is it never existed. Lesson learned.
It would have been different if someone had called me and tried to sell me something (scammer), I would never have given him a cent. The unfortunate thing was I directly contacted the scammer.
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Post by northernfarmer on Oct 16, 2021 4:24:30 GMT -6
I knew there had to be a plausible scenario of some sort that would cause a customer to pay before delivery and indeed we have paid for various items such as grain augers, combine header etc that was sitting on a dealers lot or another obvious is buying something on auction with no in person visual ( only photos etc ). Who would have thought a company of that size would have any need to create fairy stories about fictitious pieces of equipment to keep afloat. To stoop to such lows and the backlash that is sure to follow them around would in my mind mean they are in awful financial shape or one would at least think that would be the case as I can't see constant stunts like this helping their long term sales figures.
I just have this fuzzy warm feeling there is a whole stock of LEON equipment just sitting at trade shows on both sides of the border at this moment ready to be hauled, just waiting on customers to dial that number. In fact I bet they even have famous actors answering the phones in telethon style ready to take your money NOW as they flash a new updated sales figure on the screen every few minutes ! |
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Post by Albertabuck on Oct 16, 2021 8:30:46 GMT -6
Kevlar you made a comment I would like to ask you about, you said "most people here wouldn't have any issue paying...ect". Curious, is "here" your locality or do you mean the forum?
Reason why I ask, several years ago I sold a feed mixer that had come as part of the inventory I bought out of my fathers estate. Young guy from Manitoba wanted it and was all gung ho Friday nite to drive up here to get it. I then finally asked the ultimate question and that is how he intended to pay for it. A cheque was his simple reply. I won't deny he was not too happy with my response. How he did it I don't know, but when he with his wife and four kids showed up at 7AM Sunday morning he had the cash. He claimed that where he was from, people take cheques no issue. I asked a few others about this and got told that is a "Manitoba" thing. So is it or isn't it? Because here in my world I always view a cheque from a stranger as not being worth the paper its written on. I've simply been screwed way too many times over the years.
On a side note, I would never pay in advance to even someone like Deere either, there is no reason to have to do it. Again, a deposit, thats different.
Thinking back, the only thing I ever paid for in advance was my air compressor in the shop. Was a truckload sale deal that Alberta Tool Liquidators had, and it wasn't till I got in there that I realized what was up. Well below normal cost, they had to be paid in advance, would be about a three week wait period as they were ordering them by the truck load as that many were sold, thats how the price was as low as it was. This was early 90s and how I ened up with what has been a very good investment, and yes I did reluctantly pay the $459 up front. Few weeks later got a call and we went to town and picked it up and its still running today.
That would be the only time ever I have paid for something in advance with the knowledge I had to wait to receive it.
Doing so, is not normal business practice in my experience.
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There likely isn't a farm around in western Canada that doesn't have, or has had, a piece of Leon equipment, that must say something? Wrong! Most people here wouldn't have any issue paying for something from RME or Mazer's and have it delivered at a later date, and this wasn't a huge sum of money so didn't give it too much worry. So it was supposedly already built, just needed to deliver. Only thing is it never existed. Lesson learned.