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Post by meskie on Apr 27, 2024 16:52:24 GMT -6
The newer engines have lots of spots that the oil never drains out from. That’s the reason oil turns black so quick. Our N14 is the same way. Pull the valve covers off and there is a gallon of oil just sitting in various spots
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Post by kenmb on Apr 27, 2024 17:14:15 GMT -6
Picked up another Wix XD filter same as I had on before. Installed as it should and no leaks. The Case filter was installed fine, no double gaskets, no tore gasket. All looked as it should. Looking in the filter and the Wix looks correct. The center of the filter adapter has an extension with a flat machined surface and the Wix looks like it had the correct seat with a rubber seal to engsge with that extension. This should seal the clean oil in the center from the dirty oil flowing around the outside of filter. The Case filter is tapered and no rubber seal. I am guessing there is some interference in this area with the filter adapter that caused the filter to bottom out before the outer seal properly seated against the filter adapter. The Case filter didn't feel smooth spinning off the first turn or two. Had to pull pretty good on the filter wrench to get it loose so it was tight enough. Phoned Case and gave them the part number off the filter housing and said that was the right number. I don't think I agree. Or it's the right number on the wrong filter canister. Ran the tractor for an hour with the Case filter and had 46 psi oil pressure, ran with the Wix and is at 42-43 psi which is same as last year with the other Wix.
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Post by northernfarmer on Apr 27, 2024 17:31:25 GMT -6
I would say don't throw that Case IH filter away, first drain it upside down for a while and then keep it stored away in a plastic bag and box of some sort and bring it to Case at some point if you want to follow through on this. Like you said, it probably bottomed out elsewhere before it properly compressed the gasket and why it was leaking, either the wrong filter but marked with the right p/n or not properly manufactured. Good thing you caught that and swapped it out.
I don't own anything that has such a filter design with large diameter threads and an inner sealing surface to separate the dirty oil from clean side of filter. They must have done that for a reason, higher flow perhaps.
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Post by kenmb on Apr 27, 2024 19:08:49 GMT -6
Yes, once I got it off and started looking at things, the Case unit doesn't make sense and I should not have put it on in the first place. But I have seen stranger things where I thought it didn't make sense but that's how it was. I am thinking the same - I should take it back to dealer and get them to pull the same part number off the shelf and see how it looks inside. 
CNH 84372057 does cross to a Fleetgard with matches a Cummins qsx15 and the CNH # is good for a 20p5 stx450 so the numbers all seem correct. The filter itself seems wrong so think I will take it back and see if I can learn something.
To Oatkings post, no I don't change oil yearly. The old saying, if its working well don't fuk with it is fitting for today. I have a number of engines that get 30 to 100 hrs a year, they don't get yearly oil changes. And I very much doubt that will ever be a problem. Yes people talk of condensation and acid. You will know if you have condensation issues so I don't put much into that. And as for acid, I doubt 50 hours is enough to do that, and I wonder how much of an issue it really is. I suspect there are just as many issues created by people servicing something that doesn't need it vs people letting things run till a suitable interval. And "suitable" doesn't necessarily mean oem recommendations - some of those are very questionable.
If you have ever seen someone service something wrong, or don't do it properly, or forget to tighten something or just do something stupid, then you will understand what I mean about not servicing something that really doesn't need it. It occurred to me that the gear box in the combine that the dealer changed oil on but didn't refill properly is another good example.
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Post by OptimallyDismal on Apr 27, 2024 19:47:41 GMT -6
Now you get to find out how good your parts guys are.
I have a truck with a Fram fuel filter, it crossed to another number that was a completely different size thread, turn out the Fram is discontinued and the replacement is very different, took a parts GIRL to notice you can get the filter base that is what the new filter fits for $30. In the mean time they were prepared to refund my money on the filter, even though I had filled it with diesel, once I had the proper base I didn't have to return the filter anyway.
Always start with the oldest one behind the parts counter unless it is electronic parts is my new plan.
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Post by bob123 on Apr 28, 2024 17:51:23 GMT -6
Speaking of insanely priced parts , any of you shocked when you get your yearly filter bill ! Oh man , mine is close to 6000 dollars just for oil and air filters ! What's really crazy is the extra markup for fleet vs non fleet accounts. I did some mechanic work this winter for a trucking company and took part of my payment in fleetguard filters at the price that they pay, it's about 30% the price of cnh filters, and less then half of what a dealer will sell fleetguard filters to the guy off the street at. So I got 2 years supply for all my engines at that price. Not sure what kind of volume a guy would need to get that discount. Maybe it's time farmers start "real co-ops" again |
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Post by Oatking on Apr 28, 2024 19:22:12 GMT -6
I have got my air filters cleaned at clean air in Winnipeg .
They do a great job .
The reason I started this is I got fed up buying air filters for my John Deere 9520r at 700 dollars a year.
Those suit case air filters are insanely expensive !
Clean air will test and clean filters and replace if they fail quality .
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Post by meskie on Apr 28, 2024 20:30:15 GMT -6
Speaking of insanely priced parts , any of you shocked when you get your yearly filter bill ! Oh man , mine is close to 6000 dollars just for oil and air filters ! What's really crazy is the extra markup for fleet vs non fleet accounts. I did some mechanic work this winter for a trucking company and took part of my payment in fleetguard filters at the price that they pay, it's about 30% the price of cnh filters, and less then half of what a dealer will sell fleetguard filters to the guy off the street at. So I got 2 years supply for all my engines at that price. Not sure what kind of volume a guy would need to get that discount. Maybe it's time farmers start "real co-ops" again Shop around on fleetgaurd filters. Dealers that sell more get a better deal. Truck dealers are usually the cheapest for engine and fuel. One ag dealer here has a better regular price then the dealer across the road has on a 25% off sale. |
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Post by kenmb on May 2, 2024 8:40:40 GMT -6
Understand this better now, the center extension fits inside the filter, doesn't press up against it like I got my initial impression looking at the Wix seal design. Looking up underneath the tractor doesn't give a good view of the adapter. Took the filter to the dealer and compared to another Case and Fleetgard filter and all are the same. The Case is probably a Fleetgard as it looks the same. Looked at a Baldwin and then it sank in as to how it works, there is an O-ring around inside diameter of the Baldwin but can't see it in the picture. Found a Baldwin demonstration video showing the same adapter and same filter for a Qsx15 with cross sectional view of interface. Interesting that the Baldwin video said to get the 3/4 of turn after contact, even if you need a filter wrench. I was already pulling on the wrench more than I thought needed to get a filter to seal. I will look at the threads of that Case filter of mine, I bet the feel I got from thinking filter was hitting something in the adapter is probably just as easily explained as bad threads and maybe why I just couldn't get it tightened down properly.
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Post by kenmb on May 2, 2024 9:18:04 GMT -6
Probably a good time to ask, what is a good tool for these big filters? I have been using one of these strap wrenches with 1/2" drive ratchet that has been on the farm for 40 years, never thought of buying something different but likely should. I see there is a metal band version that you use a ratchet to turn. Is that the best option or is there something else.
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Post by garyfunk on May 2, 2024 9:48:07 GMT -6
We use a big grip plier made for filters.
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Post by northernfarmer on May 2, 2024 10:18:04 GMT -6
I have a few sizes of metal strap wrenches that are size specific and have their own handle and while good for some applications they will bend the handle with any tougher filter removal job. I have a larger strap wrench with aluminum handle ( might be a Ridgid ) that is geared around taking FING hard filters off as per air dryer spin on filter on a truck but that is the only application I have used it for. I also have a set of filter plyers but realized after I should have bought the largest size, they do work good though on some filters but they dent the filter so not something one wants to use to install a filter. But here is one that has been a go to filter wrench for a few sizes of filters, larger filters on tractors such as engine, hydraulic filters, highway tractor engine oil filter etc and at times put a 18" ratchet and have reefed hard on it. I won't claim its the best on the market as I am sure its not for that style but I've gotten a lot of use out of it both installing and removing filters. The only issue with it is if there is a lack of room as if its adjusted smaller the two metal arms will stick out in the way of objects. I never tighten the nut on the adjuster bolt, just spin it up by finger and its ready to go on the size I need. It uses a 1/2" drive and there have been times I have used an extension to reach up from under the frame for a highway tractor to get close to the head of the filter.
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Post by meskie on May 2, 2024 10:47:11 GMT -6
We just use the adjustable filter wrench. The water pump style adjustment. If that doesn’t work it gets a punch pounded through it and taken off. Haven’t had to that in a while. Oil the seal before it goes on and it’s east to take off
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Post by Oatking on May 2, 2024 12:12:30 GMT -6
I am too looking for a better filter wrench .
I finally got mad this spring and will pay the piper for a snap on!
Darn Canadian tire and princess pliers seem to bend and than it’s garbage !
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Post by kenmb on May 2, 2024 12:40:26 GMT -6
I am finding more filters where I don't have room to swing a handle. This Steiger filter I go up from underneath with about a 12" extension to get the ratchet below level of oil pan and then I can turn it. I suppose if it was easier to get to I may have tried tightening it more but that Case filter and using my strap wrench felt like it was fairly tight already. Awkward to work on. Have put a punch through a filter before, also used the air chisel at base of filter to spin one off when every other plan failed. Had some time to day. Don't understand filter construction but I guess these two elements work like a primary filter and a bypass filter arrangement in one can.    |
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