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Post by kenmb on Jul 27, 2021 18:44:35 GMT -6
The idea crossed my mind that upgrading the grain truck might help me quite a bit at harvest and seeding. The only truck I have now and only tandem I have really operated is the 76 Kenworth, 350 Cummins set at 400hp, 13 speed, 24.5 tires, Hendrickson solid mount walking axle suspension. Truck had a few different lives with last being a picker truck before previous owner put grain box on for other jobs.
Wife helps haul grain with the wagons as the KW is a bit of a challenge. With time she could get used to it but the wagons work well. But I could use more truck/wagon capacity in the field when I am working alone and a second truck at seeding would be nice for running around for seed and fertilizer. So the idea of a truck with auto transmission seemed like something that solves a number of issues.
The thing is I have no idea what to look for and what to stay away from.
I talked with the guys at CIM trucks in Humboldt Sk as they have a number of options. They also said there would be no issue doing a trade in a year or two later if I find the truck I buy now isn't working out the way I am used to. Seems $70-$80k is the typical price. This is the auction value of my entire harvest lineup of combine, headers, truck and swather but it is what it is. I don't mind a little debt if it makes life easier.
If you scroll through the link, the trucks are listed by year. There is an 2007 International at $72k I beleive and the 2004 Freight liner with Allison is $78k and 271,000 km. I kind of like the idea of the 2004 with Allison. Looks like something the wife could drive easy enough but it is quite different than what I am used. Like comparing a 1 ton to 1/2 ton.
I have 3 mile hauls to the yard and it is a tight yard, also don't think wife would be thrilled about wheeling a semi trailer around so keeping my thoughts on a tandem.
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Post by Albertabuck on Jul 27, 2021 18:50:41 GMT -6
Nothing wrong with an automatic for what you want it for, that being a full automatic as in Allison.
Save yourself a crap load of money and buy a suitable truck and either rig it yourself or have it done. What one pays for a ready to go unit is beyond stupid.
I'll add this, its not a huge deal to have to stretch frame rails or such either. Many rig up shops out there, well least there is in this part of the woods. Most older trucks can be had for @ 10-20K at Righteous Brothers, that leaves a lot on the table for rig up and the box.
and thats not auto correct in motion there either, RB in these parts has a new name lol, I thought it was priceless when I first heard it.
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Post by meskie on Jul 27, 2021 19:59:18 GMT -6
Nothing wrong with a tandem with a Allison auto in it. Besides the price.
I would avoid the autoshift transmissions just my preference. Only time I’ve drove a tandem with a Allison was when a guy brought a couple to our shop for us to do some exhaust work on. After driving it around the yard its what I would get if I was buying a tandem. I don’t mind shifting gears but that auto seemed pretty handy.
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Post by carlos on Jul 27, 2021 20:10:50 GMT -6
Why avoid the auto shift trans? I have a 10sp autoshift with clutch in a 2001 Columbia. Have had it for 10 years, so far no trouble with it.
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Post by meskie on Jul 27, 2021 20:16:32 GMT -6
Why avoid the auto shift trans? I have a 10sp autoshift with clutch in a 2001 Columbia. Have had it for 10 years, so far no trouble with it. Mostly don’t like the way they shift or don’t shift at times. More personal choice then mechanical reasons.
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Post by cptusa on Jul 27, 2021 20:51:08 GMT -6
We're slowly moving to autos for the FD, our newest tanker is on a freightliner chasis, 400-450 hp, twin screw, 3500 gallons, allison auto. First call we had it on was extreme spring thaw, nightmare scenario soft roads and it worked like a champ, very impressive. Yeah they're more money but it's tough to find guys that can jump in a drive a manual tranny anymore then combined that with an adrenaline rush... it ain't pretty.
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Post by jcalder on Jul 27, 2021 21:31:19 GMT -6
Our pumper that was new in 16 is an auto, it works pretty good. International truck though with a maxxforce, so that sucks. Haha.
The old FL70 shaker with the cummins is also an auto. That one leaves something to be desired.
On the farm our tender truck is an auto. 60 series Detroit with a 10 speed, no clutch. That one is kinda hard to maneuver. It's very jumpy. I prefer our T800's with 13 speeds.
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Post by torriem on Jul 27, 2021 22:27:58 GMT -6
For a tandem grain truck no question the Allison is better than the autoshift or ultrashift. It will be much smoother, easier to back up to the auger, can creep it along if need be, with no risk of burning up a clutch. They will feel more sluggish than the auto-shifting manual (torque is derated a bit when you first start out to save the driveline), but in reality they aren't any slower. Does take some getting used to as they don't drive like a car. The easiest way to run them when loaded is to mash the pedal to the floor until you get to the speed you want.
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Post by SWMan on Jul 27, 2021 22:45:42 GMT -6
Had good luck with my Volvo I-shift trucks, bought new in 2013 and pulled tridems and super-b's off lots of soft fields and muddy yards and never made a bad shift. I think the Mack M-drive is the same transmission. Had Eaton ultrashift previous in a Peterbilt and it did weird things sometimes. Important with an autoshift that you can lock it in a gear and turn the traction control off if you get in a muddy or icy situation, sometimes wheel slippage can lead to an unwanted shift and traction control is usually a PITA in those moments too.
An Alison should work fine too, but best thing is to take it for a test drive and see what suits your liking.
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Post by northernfarmer on Jul 27, 2021 22:50:28 GMT -6
I've not had the opportunity to drive an automated manual transmission but have watched video of a petite person driving two different three pedal units and the struggling with the clutch seemed to be a big deal and the transmission doing stupid things as it didn't seem as smart as I thought it should have been. But that clutch issue and of course applies to a true manual trans is a problem for those that don't have the height/weight/strength to work it properly. I've driven older Allison tandem trucks but were not set up as a grain truck but that concept works, like Torriem said its different then a passenger vehicle as its foot down on the throttle and drive it like you stole it to make it perform like it is capable of and yet can inch it around and no worries about damaging a clutch or not being able to manipulate a clutch pedal properly. With a little teaching anyone can drive one, no popping clutches or drive shafts flying. I am only guessing most these days would come with a Jake brake or the hydraulic retarder option ( those have three pedals ) .
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Post by Oatking on Jul 28, 2021 7:21:37 GMT -6
Ken,mb, I wouldnt be nervous about an autoshift transmission. Also I run International 9400s, 1 579 Peterbilt, and a t800 Kenworth. Also drove a freight shaker as well. I found the Kenworth to have the best cab in regards to less noise, shakes and rattles, and I like the way instruments are laid out. You Know what, I got nothing against a paccar engine in fact I find it to be a very smooth running 13l engine. Only complaint is the jake break is a little weaker than the isx 15l engine. The paper filters for the paccar are ok to install. I would recommend the 18 speed over the 13spd if you want a standard transmission. One of the major problems of converting a highway tractor to a boxed grain truck is dealing with the existing rads. I have changed a few rads up to a high flow rad for better performance on soft roads and heavy weight. Also try and find a gear ratio of at least 3.71 or more like 4.1. Try and get a truck that has been deleted. The major problem with grain trucks is they usually idle for a length of time and doesnt generate enough heat sometime to do a successful regen. I had my egr valve stick on me once and it nearly over heated because of such thin dirty oil. Also if you have the chance get a remote lift hoist and end gate. Your wife will love that and save you from a lot of dust. If you have patients in purchasing a truck ask for or pay for an engine oil analysis.
How well do the remote tarp open and closures work.
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Post by kenmb on Jul 28, 2021 7:26:24 GMT -6
I know what you are saying AB about building a truck. These prices are high in my mind as I bet 98% of the trucks I see listed are repurposed units by adding a grain box. The problem I have is that working on heavy trucks is not something I know and then to really get price down I need to find a decent box and hoist used and they just don't seem to exist. So a big jump in price comes from buying the new box and hoist and then whatever the learning process costs me from time to start to finish. It's easy to overspend when muddling my way through something I have never done. It's why I am thinking I bite the bullet and pay the extra $10 to $20k to have someone do it. But the other side of the argument is that with enough people doing this kind of thing the market tightens up a bit on prices since a guy trying to sell with a huge profit built in may be sitting on his inventory of trucks for a while. I don't know though. I might buy the wrong $20k base truck and find I need to throw $10k just to get the truck fixed. I really don't know what to look for on these things. Truck starts, moves forward and back, no funny noises is how I can assess, that leaves a lot of area for $10k to $20k of other things lurking that I missed. I have learnt enough things working on the KW but not nearly what I would know if I had worked with a dozen trucks over the years.
The comments in threads about automated shift trucks is the Volvo and Mack's never have a bad opinion. I wouldn't have a brand preference so owning one of these wouldn't bother me. It seems a true automatic as in Allison seems a good fit for a grain box, short hauls, and maneuvers in around the yard. Don't know if it matters too much, just my impression. I don't need 450hp to do what I need to do. A 300 ish would likely work just fine.
Does a guy get concerned with size of rear ends or tire size? I have no issue with the KW hauling out of fields, starting out in soft ground like spring when filling drill and such. Do such issues start coming up when a guy has a lighter spec truck but 600 bushels in the box. The KW sure seems to lurch, twist and groan making some turns on approaches and such so does that mean that 17 tons or so sitting on the frame needs consideration when shopping for a truck that was repurposed from say a cargo van to grain truck.
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Post by meskie on Jul 28, 2021 8:50:39 GMT -6
Tire size isn’t real important to me. If it was a choice I would pick 24.5 but not a deal breaker at all. Rear ends on a grain truck shouldn’t matter too much. Our one tandem has 38 rears and the other has 36 I think. Never had trouble with them. They only get used to haul silage now. Rear ends are less of a concern if you have lower horsepower.
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Post by torriem on Jul 28, 2021 13:27:03 GMT -6
Our tandem truck with the Allison 6 speed is only 250 hp. That's enough to haul 600 bu of wheat around, and start out in soft fields. Since the torque is more constant and smooth, less hp goes farther. No idea what differential ratio it has. Used to be a potato truck before we got it so I imagine is geared down a bit, but can do 110 kph full out.
We've always had shorter (as in not tall) boxes on our tandems as they can easily hold a legal load, and I can still heap them up to almost 600 bu if I want to. A tall box is too easy to overload. But if you're hauling a lot of light crops that would probably be the way to go.
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Post by Albertabuck on Jul 28, 2021 18:59:55 GMT -6
38K axles plenty good for a body job. Tires don't matter. I was packing 600bu on my '75 GM C65 tag axle with a single 23K drive. Same with power, 300 range be lots. And remember, the wider front rubber you run on it, the worse it will drive and steer. Anything much over a 315 skids a lot in wet conditions.
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