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Post by Albertabuck on Mar 17, 2021 20:29:46 GMT -6
This discussion reminds me of that story about the jet breaking the sound barrier over a ranch. The limo jumped over the fence never to be seen of again. The angus ran through the fence. The Hereford stood there and prolapsed. I get them damm F18s flying thru here every once in a while, out of SW towards NE, just above the tree tops and always at least two, sometimes three. Coming from Cold Lake weapons range, f'k me, never mind scare the shit of the everything including the squirrels, I've damm near shit myself too, more than once I have actually seen them before I heard them, well by the time you hear them at least the first one is already long gone lol. Wouldn't be so bad if they weren't flying so bloody low |
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Post by SWMan on Jun 28, 2021 22:52:30 GMT -6
AB I hope it's okay if I post a bull question in here.
Got my herd of Simmental cows with 2-5 week old calves, need to look for a bull somewhat soon. Was thinking red Angus but also saw some nice Charolais bulls the other day(one was brown but others white). What would guys pick between those two and other useful tips are always welcome. I have one black angus cow and it was bred to a mini-jersey and has a heifer calf, so I suppose that heifer might be my main concern for big calves. Most of these Simmental cows are pretty large animals it seems to me.
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Post by meskie on Jun 28, 2021 23:30:32 GMT -6
What color of simmental cows do you have? For ease of calving I would go with angus. Angus calves are much more lively when first born. SIMM or char calves tend to be lazy and dopey. Would depend on the bloodline of your cows if I would go red or black. Black angus bull can give grey calves off more traditional simmental cows.
If the cows are large the angus makes a nice cross to take a bit of size out of them also.
Your size large and my large sized cows may differ. Most of our cows are in the 15-1800lb range.
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Post by SWMan on Jun 28, 2021 23:35:04 GMT -6
Here you go, you probably know more looking at this picture than I am gonna produce...ha ha  |
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Post by cptusa on Jun 29, 2021 6:32:19 GMT -6
Red angus on those girls should be a nice cross.
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Post by garyfunk on Jun 29, 2021 6:46:34 GMT -6
SWMan, if you're thinking about keeping hfrs or maybe even selling replacement types, red angus on those cows would make some beauties 👌. Gonna need a two yr old or older or a BIG yearling bull to reach those cows.
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Post by Albertabuck on Jun 29, 2021 7:18:35 GMT -6
Not sure if its a local thing or not, but in this area a heavy simm influence is most desired with the buyers when they're buying calves, and sometimes there is substantially higher price over others. That was the general drift of my original comments at the beginning of this thread. I run an angus simm mix, older cows are more angus, simm influence becoming higher in later generations, but still running angus, simm or angus simm cross bulls. Did add some limo to the mix with a little angus limo cross guy I got for breeding heifers, was really impressed with how that come out, have some nice replacements to bring online in the next year or two, changed the simm red to a more orange color and that distinctive limo head shape. Was worried they might be a bit flighty as limo often are, but very docile and easy to handle and the angus took off the horns as well. Was a few that did grow some nubbs, be interesting to see how far that get passed along. But then I have seen that as well from polled simm and simm cross bulls too. My advice is avoid anything with full blown horns. You also get nailed on price when they are packing those as well.
Like Meskie, I have larger frame cows, with some smaller ones, but still go for a small size calf for ease of birthing. And if the mom has milk, them little guys grow like weeds.
Like speckle park, seems they don't like the chars anymore, especially the tan colored. Seems if they aren't red or black, you get nailed. With mine I get a mix of the two colors, and they don't even separate them anymore, reds and blacks all sold together. But most herds I know of are running some kind of simm mix, hereford to shorthorn.
That midget heifer probably best treated as such, generally things like that don't work into the mix with larger animals. Usually demand for jerseys, personally unless I was looking to keep a milk cow, I would be finding a new home for her when shes older. Especially given she's a midget.
Even with my large cows, I prefer a 60-80 lbs calf, and choose the bulls accordingly. Heifers even smaller. Even then, you can still get some that end up in trouble with larger calves, but the majority will be in that range. To get the smaller calves, you generally need more heavy angus influence in the bull, especially when using him on heifers. And I also wait till the girls are two before they even get bred, so they are three, so pretty much all there when having first calf, again, less birthing issues related to size.
Since you don't have a lot, something to look into as a viable option perhaps is renting a bull. Especially if you calve later than most, more availability as some are already pulling their bulls now.
And yea like Gary just said, you need something bigger than a yearling. Personally I prefer a more mature bull like a two year or more.
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Post by SWMan on Jun 29, 2021 22:37:28 GMT -6
Excellent thanks guys. I will narrow my search to red Angus and two year old at least.
AB if you knew how much milk my kids drink you would know why my wife bought that heifer calf. her mom is a black angus and she's definitely smaller than the Simmentals, but was a bottle calf apparently. We will see how big the heifer calf gets and go from there. It's a good looking calf, my gut tells me it stays...
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Post by Albertabuck on Jul 13, 2021 18:54:34 GMT -6
So how many knew it was Cow Appreciation Day?
Sucks when so limited on the amount you can say...its two different cows, first pic was just this morning, the other two from the other day. Point it still the same. Does piss me off when all the cowboys bitch and call them dumb because the cow is smarter than they are lol.
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Post by SWMan on Jul 13, 2021 19:19:28 GMT -6
I have my cows trained to come to the side of the pen and get a cold shower from the garden hose a couple times a day, how's that for appreciation! Ha Ha Also fished one out of the tire waterer a week ago, came home and she's on her side stuck! I think another cow bumped her in there, she seems okay. Good cow with a nice big steer calf too, my initiation into livestock I suppose.  |
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Post by meskie on Jul 13, 2021 22:11:21 GMT -6
If you have livestock your gonna have deadstock. Lol.
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Post by garyfunk on Jul 13, 2021 22:40:38 GMT -6
If you have livestock your gonna have deadstock. Lol. Beat me to it, ha. |
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Post by SWMan on Sept 9, 2021 20:47:14 GMT -6
If you have livestock your gonna have deadstock. Lol. Okay so yesterday morning there is a cow out in the pasture laying on her side and not moving, looked dead from the fence and then I saw a hoof move. Went an got the telehandler and gave her a little lift and she popped right up! Not sure how she got in that position but what kind of dumb creatures can't even stand up from the laying position... So I have them grazing in this cover crop I seeded this spring, oats/millet/sorghum/peas/soybeans/sunflowers. Seems to be a lot of crown millet in there and their dung is loaded with it, I wonder if they are even digesting it all. Some of them are looking a bit large, not sure if they are a bit bloated or not? I threw a dose of the bloat-eze in the water trough and put a hay bale out to supplement for now. What do you guys think? The one that tipped over yesterday is front and center. Just put the bull out there a few weeks ago so not like they are pregnant or anything. He's the one on her right, our left...red angus bull.  |
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Post by kevlar on Sept 9, 2021 20:54:55 GMT -6
I think cows are only one notch up from chickens and fainting goats on the list of stupid creatures! If a cow lays down on a side hill with it's feet on the high side, they are screwed. I drove past a neighbors cows a few years ago that had gotten into a patch of alfalfa and were laying with all 4 feet straight up. They never could get back up!
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Post by Albertabuck on Sept 9, 2021 21:19:09 GMT -6
Cows have a bad habit of as my father called it...committing suicide. It is more prevelant with fats. Mature cattle are somewhat like turtles, when they get on their backs or even tilted that way, they are screwed, kind of the opposite of how a fat bumblebee can fly, they can not roll themselves back onto their stomachs and feet. If you ever hear random bellering or a deep bawling or ongoing growl, also extremely loud breathing, you go check things out fast. You usually have several minutes before they suffocate. You need to be careful they don't get you with a foot, if they make contact they can kill you in one shot, I have used everything from a twine to my hayhook to grab a back leg and roll them all the way over, surprising how easy it can be done at times. Like you, when timing is right, have flipped a couple with bale forks.
What happens is their center of gravity gets to high and they can't get back over. Often its because they laid on a sidehill or slope, or in a small depression. Sides of bedding packs are one of the most common places. Even laying up against a bale feeder or fence can get them out of wack. Its frustrating when you find them when its over, very often is one of the better animals.
Bloat is often, but not always, indicated by a swelling of the stomach on the left side and it will be raised several inches about the backbone. What I see in your pic is some fat cows, thats how they should look. As for what they are eating, as long as they are introduced to new feed while full, usually not a problem, never do it when they are hungry, thats a disaster in waiting. Often seeds will pass thru and look undigested, some are still intact, but many if you inspect them, you find they have been broken down inside. An example is whole oats, a few percent will survive the passage and will still grow, but most don't, but to look at their turds, you'd think they all were intact.
I checked but can't find a picture of a young heifer, well she is going on four now, I have that has stomach nerve issues and appears bloated all the time. Does it on all types of grass and feed except silage. Interesting thing with her is it does not effect her. Started when she was a yearling, was some quick intervention with the vet and more as she was such a sweet heart. We soon realized it was a nerve issue and would never go away. Two things happened after that, she basically stopped growing except widthwise and never come into heat or cycled. Wouldn't have got anything for her anyway, so she was kept basically as a pet and someone to run with younger ones to help keep them calm and easier to move ect., except she makes a piss poor lead cow lol, just the other day tried taking the yearling heifers into the trees, had more issues with her than the the young ones lol. I thought I had pics on my computer but I guess not, well least can't find them, if I do I will post one so you can see very clearly what bloat really looks like. Under usual circumstances when they look like she does most of the time, a normal one would be dead.
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